Unknown mark SA on colonial teaspoon

[samtron76df]

Have a colonial teaspoon with mark of SA and have been unable to find a good match. I think it is American and there is a foliate scroll on the back of the bowl. It does not match published marks for Samuel Avery but appears to be from his time period. Wonder if anyone would know who this is...

[samtron76df]

Actually, I think it predates Avery...

[Aguest]

Silas Ayers
(1749-1826)

No known examples, but that's more like the date of birth that I would expect with this spoon. :::: I'm guessing made in 1770s. ::::

Samuel Avery is so close, you just want it to be Samuel Avery so badly, and yet Samuel Avery is too late for the form. ::::

Still there's a small chance it could be a very early piece by Samuel Avery?

[Aguest]

Wait, that's the father of Ayers, that was not a silversmith. ::::: Error. 404. :::::

[samtron76df]

BRIX has a Samuel Alford in Philadelphia listed as a goldsmith & Jeweler...

Alford, Samuel Goldsmith & Jeweller Adv. 1759-1762

[samtron76df]

and there is a Samuel Allardice listed in Kovels who was in Phil. and died in 1798...

hoping someone has this mark attributed somewhere... fingers crossed...

thank you for your research...

[Aguest]

The fancy-back part of the spoon made me think about Philadelphia. ::::

[Obadiah Rich]

I have another fancy back (toy) spoon with a very similar SA mark, and some others which don't quite smell right for English hallmarks. Sadly, though, I can't add the image to this thread.

[dognose]

Hi,

Welcome to the Forum.

You may add images, it's very easy.

The below should help you:

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Trev.

[wev]

Neither Alford or Allardice are mentioned in Hollan's Philadelphia, nor any makers with the initials SA.
That form of foliate back (from what I can make out in the image) was more popular in Boston c 1775-1790. That said, I do not have any likely candidate to offer.

[Aguest]

::::::: Looking at the works of Samuel Alexander, he did make a Cann in the older style, so could he have made a teaspoon in the older style as well? :::::::: The "S" on the hallmark on the Cann does look similar to the "S" in the "SA" on colonial teaspoon. :::::::::;

[Aguest]

[Aguest]

Samuel Alexander is listed in James Biser Whisker's book Pennsylvania Silversmiths, Goldsmiths and Pewterers, 1684-1900 as a silversmith and sword maker. 1797-1801 are listed as the dates he was at 33 S. Second St. in Philadelphia, but birth and death dates are not listed.

From the Federal Gazette: "5 June 1797 Wiltberger & Alexander, Silversmiths and Jewelers, have this day dissolved their partnership by mutual consent. As Mr. Wiltberger has authorized himself to settle the business without my knowledge, I therefore think it my duty to inform my friends and the public that I am neither dead, insolvent or run away, but that I have lately removed to the house formerly occupied by Mr. Wiltberger, in South Second Street, No.33 where I mean to carry on the business in all its branches, on the most reasonable terms. N.B. the highest price will be given for old gold and silver, By Samuel Alexander."

Belden also has Alexander listed, but again his birth and death dates are not listed nor who he apprenticed with.

[wev]

Alexander was several times bankrupt after the short-lived partnership c 1796-1797, with Wiltberger. Failing in a shop of his own, he worked for Anthony Simmons before formally becoming his partner in Simmons & Alexander, c 1804-1808. Sometime after he moved to Richmond VA, likely to escape his debts, and worked making presentation swords in association with Johnson & Reat. He went to NYC in January 1821 to work on sword commissions with John Targee, where he again went bankrupt. Richmond records recorded his death in June 1821.

His S•A looks nothing like the SA on the OP's spoon.

[Aguest]

::::: Is there an [SA] mark known by Samuel Alexander or is it always {S (pellet) ALEXANDER] no matter how small the spoon is? ::::::::::
:::::: Seems like a rather long hallmark but maybe that is the only hallmark he used ::::::::

[wev]

His initial mark -- shown in Hollan's Philadelphia -- is A • S

[juantotree]

I posted a topic back in 2019 with the same mark see: https://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=54065

Due to its shape (Celtic Point) I was leaning towards Scottish provincial, but unfortunately I have got no further with identification.

Martin

[Aguest]

:::::: If you still have your example, could you post a picture of the drop where the handle meets the bowl on the underneath side? :::::::

[juantotree]

Please see image below of the spoon drop.

Martin

[Aguest]

::::::::::::: Thank You interesting wriggle-work around the drop. :::::::::::::::::::