Help needed to ID a spoon

[stevechesh]

Hi there. I'm a complete amateur, and need some serious help please!

We are trying to put a name to an Unknown Sailing ship discovered in the English Channel. I recovered a spoon from the wreck last week, and it's hallmarked.

My camera doesn't show the marks in any great detail, however, the marks are as follows:

1st - J
2nd - B
3rd - AI or possibly A1?
4th - Very faint but looks like a star symbol?
5th - Very faint again, but looks like there could be a letter L on it's side, although it may just be part of the pattern.

Is it possible to get a date (even if it's approximate), and/or manufacturer from the info here? I would be eternally grateful.

not sure if it helps or not, but the pattern is definately 'Kings'.

Here are the poor quality photo's.

[byron mac donald]

Hello Steve-
WOW! a real treasure hunt! You won't get rich off this one though. The "A1" is a silverplate mark. I hope someone here can find you a date and maker.
Do you think you could send a better picture of the marks? maybe if you have a camera tripod, looks like the picture is a little fuzzy from your normal hand instability.

Best of luck- Byron

P.S. I would love to hear the details of you finding out who she was.

[stevechesh]

many thanks Byron. I've tried using a tripod, but my camera just can't define the marks clearly enough. I took the spoon down to a jewellers and he confirmed the marks as follows

J
B
A1
star symbol
EP

This is what i was told. . .

the JB stands for J Butler
A1 is silver plate

EP means it was electro plated.......and the date 1899/1900

Now assuming this is all correct, i can't find anything on J Butler but i've found that EP started as early as 1840 by Elkington.

In monetary terms, the spoon is worthless, however, the date and J Butler may prove priceless in identifying the wreck it was found on. If anyone can shed any light on this or point me in the right direction then your advice will be gratefully received. . . .

I'm unsure of the correct or polite protocol, I hope i don't offend or upset anyone, but here is a link to the Mystery Wreck, where the spoon was recovered http://www.weymouthdiving.com/weychieft ... pwreck.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Another spoon was recovered by a very good friend of mine a few years ago, and now i have another. . . . . . The wreck has the potential to be as important as the Mary Rose, which was raised in the 1980's.........

Thanks in advance,

Steve

[byron mac donald]

Hello Steve!

I dont know what happened, somehow I missed your reply. Thank you for the link, it is very interesting, I have, and hope others also may of had time to enjoy it. I was realy hoping that you could of got a clearer picture, since I joined this forum, I have learned how important it is to see the little details like the shape of the cartouche and the letters making up the marks.
I am glad to see that you narrowed it down to "J Butler 1899/1900" Although I do not know who he is, perhaps someone else reading this very important need for information will.
I just don't see how your jewler narrowed it down to 1899/1900 though. It being electroplated, I don't think the letter "L" would come into play as a date mark, however perhaps I will be educated better on this as well. Once again, if it is a date mark, then the shape and style is all so important to identify.
I wish I could, and really hope some body here will be able to help further. Please keep us informed as to what you find out about her.

Best Wishes and Best of Luck- Byron

[stevechesh]

back again! Got some slightly better results with a magnifying glass and a macro setting. . .

Hope these are clearer. . .

[stevechesh]

I've no idea if any of the info i was given by the jeweller is accurate. I'm open to advice and suggestions. . .

Not sure if it will sway any opinions, but part of the cargo was beer bottles from Cumbernauld Pottery, so there may be a Scottish connection with the spoon?

[2209patrick]

Hello.
Checked all my British silverplate references, but could not find that set of marks. Your spoon could date as early as the 1850's. Don't think the L is a date mark, just part of the pattern.

Checked all my British sterling and silverplate books and could not find a J. Butler. I don't think J. Butler is the manufacturer.

Wish I could have helped more.
Pat.

[LearnAll]

Just a thought - but it looks more like an anchor than a J to me and the next one could be an R instead of a B
as in Anchor R Star
Dont know what that would indicate.... but that is what i see.

[byron mac donald]

Learn All-

looking at the top of what is being described as a J, I think you may be right, it does look like it could be an anchor. It seems to have a loop on top of it doesn't it. The B still looks like a B to me though, the bottom seems to be headed back towards the vertical.

Regards- Byron