Box with unclear French & Dutch relationship. Maker?

[SilverK]

Hi,

I’m trying to identify the maker of this box and the relationship between the two sets of marks it carries. I'm hoping the forum can help.

It sports a set of French marks that seems to show it was made between 1798 and 1809, assayed in Paris and has a fineness of at least 0.950. It carries a French maker's mark that I'll come on to later, but next to this is another mark which looks like an anchor. Together with the ‘Crown over a V’ mark, they suggest to me that the box is associated with the period when the French were occupying the Netherlands between 1810 and 1814, with the anchor being the assay mark for Steenwyk. Paris is not Steenwyk, so have I misinterpreted the marks? Was it imported into this part of Holland after it was made? Was it made 1809/10? I'm not sure, so clearly there's a link between the two sets of marks that I don't understand.

The maker's mark is so poorly stamped that only part is visible. I can’t even tell which way round it should go, so I’ve presented it twice, 180 degrees to each other. There’s an obvious letter ‘s’ at the point of the diamond and a ghost of another letter which may be an H, K, M or even an N. I’ve checked the French makers marks listed on this site, but I can’t find anything that matches, so I'm hoping it's recognizable to someone on the forum.

So, there we are. Any help on both maker and origin would be very welcome!

[SilverK]

I've managed, at last, to work this one out now, my original posting being a mixture of some correct information and a lot of rubbish!

This box had a slightly complicated start to life, having been made in Paris during the Napoleonic era when the French were occupying Holland, and then imported into Nijmegen in The Netherlands around the time the annexation ended in 1813. The maker's mark isn't French, but is actually that of the Dutch importer, Steven Jansen van Middelburg of Nijmegen. I can't see a French maker's mark at all on the piece. Also, what I originally took to be an anchor is actually a very poor rendition of the double-headed eagle guild city mark for Nijmegen used between 1807 and 1813, so the first of the two orientations in the left-hand corner is the correct one.

Trev, seeing that this has both French and Dutch roots, are you able to copy this posting to the Dutch section as well?

[oel]

Hi SilverK,

You are making it all very confusing.

There is no "Steven Jansen van Middelburg of Nijmegen''. We do have a Steven van Middelburg and his maker's mark was SVM in a rectangle before and during the Kingdom of Holland, registered in Nijmegen from 1782-1811.
Your image top left is a French maker's mark in a typical French lozenge. The oval with what looks like a flower is not an office mark for the city of Nijmegen (1807-1812) but could be a remnant of a later added census mark. Your image, bottom left and right; hallmarks of the French Republic used 1798-1809.
Your image top right, the crowned V is a duty mark for imported articles, used during the Kingdom of Holland 1807-1812, the only Dutch relationship.
For the (hall)marks used during the Kingdom of Holland and examples of how the marks were placed in a nice row, see:
http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=32028

By the way, are you showing the same snuff box at the Dutch forum with other marks?


http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic ... 79#p118779

Oel.

[SilverK]

Thanks oel. Yes it is confusing and I'm obviously still wrong, but no nearer knowing its history than when I started.

Look closely at the other box - it's a different box entirely, though with very similar design and originally owned by the same person.

SilverK.

[oel]

Hi SilverK,

Thanks, all clear.


Oel.