Help Identifying Maker

danthoms · Post by **danthoms** » Mon Apr 27, 2009 12:21 am

I just bought these plates and am having a hard time identifying the maker. I'm not even positive what country they are from. Some of the pictures are kind of small so if you need something bigger please let me know. Any help would be appreciated. These are 10' wide. The combined weight of these is about 32 troy oz.

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danthoms · Post by **danthoms** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:18 pm

Here are some closer pictures of the marks. The one looks like an eagle, another a crown, the next one I don't know and the last a lion or a dog. Any ideas?

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Hose_dk · Post by **Hose_dk** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:50 am

weight 33 and 32 lod. When nationality is set you can find out what 1 lod is,
(as example in Denmark 1 lod = 15,63gram)

The lion - is that corresponding to the lion under http://www.925-1000.com/Fnetherlands_Date_Code.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
dont know wild guess.

You have number 35 and 36 so it has been a large set - the shield could give a clue also.
The story of the hunt is a nice one - the other story of the riding tour - romance. Can you show the hole story? it could be nice seeing it.
I hope that someone else can identify origin for you.
Nice engraving.
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JAKJO · Post by **JAKJO** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 4:53 am

Hi,

My first thought was Hanua and then after a while while I changed my mind and now I think they are Dutch. I am not an expert in the Dutch language, but to me "Wieg 32 lod", sounds more Dutch than German.

I think that they are made to deceive and to supply the "need" for antiques in the late 19th century. The marks look spurious, but perhaps Hose is right about the Dutch lion. The coat of arms is clearly inspired by the Danish.

. This coat of arms was used in Denmark 1947-1972.

Hope this helps.

Best regards/JAKJO
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Hose_dk · Post by **Hose_dk** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 6:05 pm

JAKJO wrote:I changed my mind and now I think they are Dutch. I am not an expert in the Dutch language, but to me "Wieg 32 lod", sounds more Dutch than German.

The coat of arms is clearly inspired by the Danish.

Best regards/JAKJO

I am sure that it is Dutch in some way. There clearly are more text than we see on pictures. After No.35 - what is written is it the text around weight?

Danish - well thar coat of arms vary from time to time. I think that I see the Irish - harp.
The one heart ?

Norwegian lion is only at one coat of arms. Well i dont know.
the weight lod is somehow corresponding to 500 grams each. Try to find out how much 1 lod is - you can tell exactly - then we can search for that.
but nederlands - I am sure.
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danthoms · Post by **danthoms** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 6:51 pm

Hose_dk wrote:
JAKJO wrote:I changed my mind and now I think they are Dutch. I am not an expert in the Dutch language, but to me "Wieg 32 lod", sounds more Dutch than German.

The coat of arms is clearly inspired by the Danish.

Best regards/JAKJO
I am sure that it is Dutch in some way. There clearly are more text than we see on pictures. After No.35 - what is written is it the text around weight?

Danish - well thar coat of arms vary from time to time. I think that I see the Irish - harp.
The one heart ?

Norwegian lion is only at one coat of arms. Well i dont know.
the weight lod is somehow corresponding to 500 grams each. Try to find out how much 1 lod is - you can tell exactly - then we can search for that.
but nederlands - I am sure.

The full text is No 35 Wieg 32 Lod and the second plate is No 36 Wieg. 33 Lod

Also after looking closer I did find one more mark of what appears to be a tiny leaf with 3 parts.

According to my scale the one marked 32 Lod weighs 49 grams and the one marked 33 lod weights 51 grams.

The one coat of arms looks to have (top left hand corner) 2 dogs or perhaps lions with long curled up tails (top right hand corner) 2 dogs or perhaps lions with long curled up tails(bottom left hand corner) 3 crowns harp and heart (bottom right hand corner) lion and snake

The second coat of arms looks to have (top left hand corner) 2 dogs or perhaps lions with long curled up tails (top right hand corner) slender horse like animal up on two feet with long tail (bottom right hand corner) 3 crowns and laying down animal (bottom right hand corner) lion and snake

I'll post more pictures too. Thanks for all the help.
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danthoms · Post by **danthoms** » Thu Apr 30, 2009 12:13 am

490 and 510 grams not 49 and 51, sorry.

I tried to photograph every picture on the plates for those of you who wanted to see the complete stories on the plates. Here is a link to the album with all the pictures.
http://s37.photobucket.com/albums/e89/d ... %20Plates/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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JAKJO · Post by **JAKJO** » Thu Apr 30, 2009 4:39 am

I am now quite convinced of the fact that the supposed Dutch lion is not the official one; the form of the mark does not fit. The weight of the plates seems to be correct though.

I am curious about the newly found leaf. Is it this one, if I am not misinformed it was used in The Netherlands between 1 January 1853 and 1 January 1906.

Best regards/JAKJO
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danthoms · Post by **danthoms** » Thu Apr 30, 2009 10:04 am

Here is the leaf mark. I only see it on one plate.

There is one more mark that I see. There are two on each plate. It doesn't look like much of anything though. Perhaps it is a date mark of some kind. I didn't see this one on the list on the site though.

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Hose_dk · Post by **Hose_dk** » Thu Apr 30, 2009 12:24 pm

danthoms wrote:(top left hand corner) 2 dogs or perhaps lions with long curled up tails (top right hand corner) slender horse like animal up on two feet with long tail

the dogs are the danish lions. 3 of them and 9 harts
The horse - Norwegian lion carrying an ax.
3 crowns the Swedish - apears in danish coat of arms due to the fact that once the danish kings ruled sweden.

De vender and de gother. Slesvig Pommern,

Look here its in danish but the names in blue represent land areas apering in the danish arms.
http://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danmarks_rigsv%C3%A5ben" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

but now we discuss the motive not the marks.
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danthoms · Post by **danthoms** » Fri May 01, 2009 9:03 am

Thanks for everyones help. So we now know its Danish. Any ideas as to when it was made and for who? I know someone said that it may have been made in the late 1800s as a fake antique. I think they are very beautiful and have been unable to find any similar pieces to compare them to.

(admin edit - see Posting Requirements )
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Hose_dk · Post by **Hose_dk** » Fri May 01, 2009 10:47 am

no they are not danish - the code of arms is inspired by danish. but the rest is not. We still wate for someone to reconise marks. Up to now the Netherlands is our guess.
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danthoms · Post by **danthoms** » Sat May 02, 2009 12:58 am

Could this be the leaf?
http://members.home.nl/jan.schipper/bio ... nsger.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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JAKJO · Post by **JAKJO** » Sat May 02, 2009 9:03 am

Hi Danthoms!

IÂ´m sorry it is not Gerrit Willems PierkensÂ´ star, because the construction of the punch must in my opinion be different. The contour line of PierkensÂ´mark is much more accentuated and it looks as though your mark is deepest in the centre.

Since 1860 there has been quite a number of Dutch makers making and copying silver objects in the old style. Many of them used pseudo-marks and they are presented in:
Valse zilvermerken in Nederland: Met 661 afbeeldingen van merken en 38 afbeeldingen van falsificaten by K. A. Citroen

Best regards/JAKJO
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