Hi -
the Postnikov mark is a fake too, the cigarette case is authentic but has not the Russian standard measures and the thumbpiece is wrong too.
Filigree work had to be stamped on certain places by order - in 20 years I have seen only 4 real pieces!
Regards
Postnikov
.
St. Petersburg 1879.
Hi Postnikov,
You got me here. I am flabbergasted. The cigarette case is authentic Russian or Indian? You say the Postnikov mark is fake and the measurements (sizes) of the case are not authentic, to what I assume, compared with normal/ordinary Russian cases. Perhaps you mean to say the hallmarks are not authentic? Wrong thumb piece, what you say is the mechanism of the thumb piece is not Russian?
I got the disturbing feeling that most Russian pieces, offered by respectable dealers and auction houses, actually could be fakes. I assume the dealers have no criminal intend but lack of knowledge and they are dealing in “perfect fakes” The down sides are the high prices people are willing to pay. Last month Christie’s sold a plain engine turned silver spectacle case for a whooping 4 figure amount, because of the name Faberge. But how can we be sure it is the real McCoy. I am afraid somewhere in the near future people will stop buying and prices will collapse. Most of the proven pieces will be in the hands of the rich “Happy Few”, like they were intended to be. I learned my lesson.
Regards,
Oel
.
You got me here. I am flabbergasted. The cigarette case is authentic Russian or Indian? You say the Postnikov mark is fake and the measurements (sizes) of the case are not authentic, to what I assume, compared with normal/ordinary Russian cases. Perhaps you mean to say the hallmarks are not authentic? Wrong thumb piece, what you say is the mechanism of the thumb piece is not Russian?
I got the disturbing feeling that most Russian pieces, offered by respectable dealers and auction houses, actually could be fakes. I assume the dealers have no criminal intend but lack of knowledge and they are dealing in “perfect fakes” The down sides are the high prices people are willing to pay. Last month Christie’s sold a plain engine turned silver spectacle case for a whooping 4 figure amount, because of the name Faberge. But how can we be sure it is the real McCoy. I am afraid somewhere in the near future people will stop buying and prices will collapse. Most of the proven pieces will be in the hands of the rich “Happy Few”, like they were intended to be. I learned my lesson.
Regards,
Oel
.
Hi oel-
to make a long story short: it is impossible to start collecting something without doing your homework - you must read, look, touch, make a comparison and learn. And than start slow...not with Fabergé or Postnikov! Be careful with auction houses, ask for expertises and money back guarantees - all the things common sense want to be done.
I will show you some pages of a book I wrote some years ago (no schilling, and no I do not sell copies and yes it is out of print)!
If you are not from an other star you know that everything is faked: boobs, fingernails, watches, silver, gold, antiques, elections etc., etc., etc.
Here are the photos of an Russian original, 142 years old, top condition, but not so shiny like the LNIB (like new in box) Indian or Chinese copies - that is patina!
Front
Back
look at the thumbpiece (for the Greenhorns: the knob you push to open...) and compare..
Here is one of the several pages of thumbpieces:
Here is the page with the different sizes
Ask some jewelers how to clean/polish filigree! Look how fresh the showcase of the cigarette case looks, etc. Maybe you use your brain?
Most of the questions you have you can answer yourselve!
But you must learn, learn, learn!
Regards and no more private lessons :-)
Postnikov
.
to make a long story short: it is impossible to start collecting something without doing your homework - you must read, look, touch, make a comparison and learn. And than start slow...not with Fabergé or Postnikov! Be careful with auction houses, ask for expertises and money back guarantees - all the things common sense want to be done.
I will show you some pages of a book I wrote some years ago (no schilling, and no I do not sell copies and yes it is out of print)!
If you are not from an other star you know that everything is faked: boobs, fingernails, watches, silver, gold, antiques, elections etc., etc., etc.
Here are the photos of an Russian original, 142 years old, top condition, but not so shiny like the LNIB (like new in box) Indian or Chinese copies - that is patina!
Front
Back
look at the thumbpiece (for the Greenhorns: the knob you push to open...) and compare..
Here is one of the several pages of thumbpieces:
Here is the page with the different sizes
Ask some jewelers how to clean/polish filigree! Look how fresh the showcase of the cigarette case looks, etc. Maybe you use your brain?
Most of the questions you have you can answer yourselve!
But you must learn, learn, learn!
Regards and no more private lessons :-)
Postnikov
.
Dear Postnikov,
Thank you very much! What I learned so far: Russian silver is popular and expensive, thus fakes are flooding the market, to satisfy the greedy mobs. Could we trust high end retailers or auction houses? Answer no they selling fakes to. Are fakes an instant problem? Perhaps not if we buy to enjoy and as long nobody tells us we are enjoying a fake. The problems arise if we are going to sell or show it on the silver forum. Then we realize we paid way to much, feel swindled, and perhaps worse can’t enjoy the item anymore. Do we all want to learn, learn, and learn? I guess not because we like to ask the experts, especially if it is for free, and then we not all can become experts. Collecting a good thing to do? I do wonder if I look at my wife’s face, when I bring in another snuff box for the “collection”, if eyes could kill…and possible fake. Collecting or investing in Russian silver is as dangerous as playing Russian roulette and we better leave it for the experts. You are a collector and expert and wrote books about Russian silver. I thank you for your private lessons. I think you are very good, firm in your answers but sometimes a bit arrogant, an excellent teacher but not my favorite teacher. Tip for your butlers on how to clean the filigree. I clean my filigree, with a soft tooth brush and silver cloth wrapped around it, regularly. Only the first time, after a soap bath, I might use the tooth brush with silver polish. After the filigree shines like a diamond. I buy silver because I love to polish in Dutch we call this a form of “bezigheidstherapie”. Cheers and with High regards,
Oel
.
Thank you very much! What I learned so far: Russian silver is popular and expensive, thus fakes are flooding the market, to satisfy the greedy mobs. Could we trust high end retailers or auction houses? Answer no they selling fakes to. Are fakes an instant problem? Perhaps not if we buy to enjoy and as long nobody tells us we are enjoying a fake. The problems arise if we are going to sell or show it on the silver forum. Then we realize we paid way to much, feel swindled, and perhaps worse can’t enjoy the item anymore. Do we all want to learn, learn, and learn? I guess not because we like to ask the experts, especially if it is for free, and then we not all can become experts. Collecting a good thing to do? I do wonder if I look at my wife’s face, when I bring in another snuff box for the “collection”, if eyes could kill…and possible fake. Collecting or investing in Russian silver is as dangerous as playing Russian roulette and we better leave it for the experts. You are a collector and expert and wrote books about Russian silver. I thank you for your private lessons. I think you are very good, firm in your answers but sometimes a bit arrogant, an excellent teacher but not my favorite teacher. Tip for your butlers on how to clean the filigree. I clean my filigree, with a soft tooth brush and silver cloth wrapped around it, regularly. Only the first time, after a soap bath, I might use the tooth brush with silver polish. After the filigree shines like a diamond. I buy silver because I love to polish in Dutch we call this a form of “bezigheidstherapie”. Cheers and with High regards,
Oel
.