Seeking info on silver cane brought back from UK

[whittiques]

Howdy,

I just got back from Europe a couple days ago and am eagerly seeking information about a magnificent silver tipped walking cane I brought back with me (purchased in a small shop in Scotland, carried it through 5 different airports as a carry on) and I have yet to find any solid information about it with the multiple marks it carries. Any help in identifying the usual details would be greatly appreciated and I humbly thank anyone willing to lend their expertise & time towards it.

The primary marks appear to read "TG" in the square, next to it is a lion figure facing left in an oval, the letter "Q" in a shield, the letter "F" in a circle, and the last one is unintelligible by me but in a shield.

On the opposite side is what appears to be a swan, but not like the type normally seen on French import silver. So perhaps a duck? With what appears to be maybe a clover next to it?

The figural on the handle is of the Greek god Vulcan forging weapons.

Images available for review below.

[larkfield]

Hi
The marks appear to be British import marks. Have a close look at the last mark which should be a Leopards head. The T. G is the importer who I believe would be Thomas Glaser, Lion Passant the Sterling mark, Q would be 1891, F for an imported item and my reading of the last mark would be a Leopards head for London.
Regards

[whittiques]

Thanks for information! I'm obviously still learning so any such help is greatly appreciated. Could I inquire about the marks on the opposite side, second picture? The what appears to be a swan or duck and I'm not sure what the other is. Since the one next to it almost appears like the French import swan, I thought maybe the other could be a faded owl also?

I do love a good mystery haha, cheers!

[silverport]

Hello

With a lot of doubts by myself, I show up:

Wilhelm Schwahn (with maker’s mark of a swan; with cartouches of several contours, related to the space, and destination of export; but also shown without cartouches, or incise).

Founded in Hanau, in 1864 — with export activities to many countries, in and outside of Europe.

Please look here, for Hanau maker’s marks: http://www.925-1000.com/Fgerman_hanau_marks_01.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There are also Swan-marks shown (a swan is symbol on Hanau town arms top) attributed to e.g.:

Possibly »Schleissner«

W. Schwahn main activity was production of jewellery, especially rings — and machines for jewellery services. So you could state: »It isn’t “Schwahn”«. But in a handy book for professionals are described in brief also many other activities of their production as well.

The second mark looks like an Austrian Assay Office mark from time period before 1866 — well, that is a lot of time span, in relation to »London, 1891« import; of at least a quarter of a century!

It’s often difficult to find out the origin »birthplace« of world wide travellers.

There are also mentioned other cane makers in Hanau in 1903 handy book (without any shown up maker’s mark): W. Behrens, Gebr. Dingeldein, Joh. Dirks, Hermann Elsass, Gertenbach & Kaiser, C. Hertel & Sohn, Nicolay & Duncker, Ott & Cie., J. D. Schleissner Söhne, Ernst Schönfeld junior, C. M. Weishaupt Söhne, Oswald Worg, Josef Zabolitzky. (»... Söhne« = Sons)

So, maybe nothing match!?

Please, would you be so kindly, and clean these two marks in question; look here how to doe it:

http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=19420" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Please read especially the contribution of »Hose-dk« - very helpful indeed.

Maybe “blacken” marks background, inside of the cartouches, by use of a non permanent marker.

Please present then after taken clear photos of the marks in question; especially that from the right side one.

Thank you!

Would the »place of birth« of this world wide traveller remain a mystery for ever?

Kind regards silverport

[whittiques]

Excellent information, thank you again as I have lots to learn. I've been curious about this cane since I found it so it's a great resolve so far.

I cleaned it up a bit but was cautious as I dare not attempt anything I may foul up haha. Hopefully the images are better.

At second glance, the mark next to the swan mark appears different than previously thought. At first it appeared as a thistle which would have made sense. However the sides are pointed downwards the top is rounded. See the outlines I did on the second image, any thoughts greatly welcome, cheers!


Outlined:

[silverport]

Hello

Maybe it’s also now for you visible, that you’re clean up of marks assists better the identification — especially it’s the case of the crown mark.

I guess now for sure that your cane must be of German origin; also by missing crescent and fineness.

In Germany from 1 January 1888 on the minimum fineness was 800-1,000, which had the right, to be struck with crescent (symbol for silver) and crown (symbol for Germany). Please look here: http://www.925-1000.com/Fgerman_marks_a1884.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

By the way: »1888« and »London, 1891« fits nicely togrther; isn't it?

Here visible is only the crown — but that don’t indicate, that the crescent wasn’t struck as well. Because the geometry of the canes handle makes this a little bit complicated — if it’s an »in one flat surface combined punch« of »Crescent, Crown, Fineness«. Maybe also for the same reason the fineness mark is missing?!

Maybe for reason of not destroying or disturbing the surface — the producer has struck only the almost simple version of his maker’s mark, the »swan«.

Maybe this cane was already, before start of production, designated for an export-import order of an in London residing import representative of German (Hanau) items of Applied art in Antique style silver? He has need even some space for the official British assay marks as well!

In Germany has exist also two other main centre of silver production — but I think, maybe only the little manufactures of Schwäbisch Gmünd, in Württemberg, could be a place of origin? Pforzheim, in Baden, was more known for her productivity in jewellery and pocket watches. But by all makers’ marks of these two places, I don’t remember any swan mark!

In Schwäbisch Gmünd is a »Living Museum« for this kind of silver ware; please visit this:

http://www.kulturpur.de/en/deutschland/ ... brik/plan/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.remstotal.de/62-Silberwarenm ... abrik.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(For more sites which includes some information’s on this, google: “Ott-Pausersche” or “Ott-Pausersche Fabrik”)

I don’t remember to have seen there, or in their ancient catalogues some thing similar as is your cane.

Maybe the towns Museum would help you, if you send them a request with a link to this question.

e-mail: redaktion@schwaebisch-gmuend.de

But my main area of source of your cane remains the area of Hanau:

In Hanau exist also a museum for this kind of silver ware; please visit this:

http://www.kulturpur.de/en/deutschland/ ... aus+hanau/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.gfg-hanau.de/e_index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Maybe their Museums Society would help you, if you send them a request with a link to this question.

e-mail: gfg-hanau@t-online.de

Sorry there fore that, actually only, I play again the ball over to you — Learning by doing!

Success - make the best of it!

Kind regards silverport

[larkfield]

There was a company called Gebruder Glaser in Hanau, which was started by Hugo and Thomas Glaser. Could the London importer Thomas Glaser be the same as the Hanau Thomas? They both seem to fit the date for the cane!

[silverport]

Hello all

Maybe Glaser? Even not?

The handy book of 1903 (these informatio's were given by themselves):

Glaser, Gebrüder, Hanau, Herrngasse 19.
(1883 [founded]) Inh.: Thomas Glaser, Hugo Glaser
und L. Birkner. Silberwaren-Fabrik. Silber-
waren antiken Genres. Ziergegenstände und
kleine Geräte. Exportgenre.

Translation:
Glaser, Brethren, Hanau, Herrngasse 19.
(1883 [founded]) Owners: Thomas Glaser, Hugo Glaser
and L. Birkner. Silver wares factory. Silver
Wares in antique style. Decorative objects and
little equipments. Export ware.

In Hanau many is possible; so it could be, but also it could be that they aren't the original producer as well.

Because there official maker's mark, shown in the same handy book of 1903, well around 10 years later, is:

G.G. (in a kind of English script style).

That's it.

Kind regards silverport

[dognose]

John Culme has some interesting notes on Thomas Glaser in his 'Directory of Gold & Silversmiths'

As a alien with no residence in the United Kingdom, Thomas Glaser's marks were cancelled c. 1894. In 1885 he had given his address as 17, Thavies Inn, Holborn, EC, which in that year is listed as a private hotel under the proprietorship of Mrs Felix A. Schreiber. Felix A. Schreiber, commission agent, is also listed here. Thomas Glaser's other addresses were 82, Wells Street, Oxford Street, W and 12 Greek Street, Soho, W, both of which are listed as hotels, the former in 1887 owned by Felix August Schreiber.

Trev.

[dognose]

I just came across a possible candidate for the 'Swan' mark. Listed in 1882 is a company called 'Schwann & Co' 13, Cross Street, Finsbury, EC. who amongest other things are listed as 'importers of walking sticks'.

Trev.

[whittiques]

Wow, I'm going to have to build up my research resources a bit more because you guys just gave me a lesson, thank you!

Any recommendations that might help me get a bit more independent and not having to bother anyone for helping identify things?

With this great information I have more than a great place to start, cheers! :)

[MCB]

Hello,

My best recommendation is to keep on reading the Forum topics. Such a lot of new information has come my way like this.

If you are interested in UK silver a good reference book is Jackson's Silver & Gold Marks of England, Scotland & Ireland edited by Ian Pickford. This publication covers most of the hallmarks used by UK Assay Offices and gives plenty of information on marks used by silversmiths.

As the fascination with UK silverware grows you may find a need for specialist publications covering a particular Assay Office; most are quite expensive however. Check out the Forum's library section for more detail.

Best wishes,
Mike

[whittiques]

Well you definitely weren't joking about good material being expensive. Personally I've been looking for a way to live / work in the UK for some time because I love it there, but it sounds easier than it is.

One of the reasons is I work for a company here that deals in diverse array of antiques & rarities but the history and relevance is what keeps my interest. With that though, since the US hasn't been around long enough to have multitudes of such thing...I'm always looking to expand my knowledge any chance I can get. So again I thank everyone who took the time to share their own, it's what keeps history from becoming forgot.

This cane now sits in my collection with a an excellent story behind it and the history to match. Cheers!