Hello, can somebody help me to read this hallmarks? I only know that LEMOR means that this item was made by silver factory of Julius Lemor, and that's all... Regards
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Cross Julius Lemor
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silverport
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Re: Cross Julius Lemor
Crucifix made by »Julius Lemor« Breslau / Wroclaw, after 1920.
Hello
Welcome to the Forum.
The crucifix, in dimension maybe destinated for a family altar, is made after 1920 by the famous Breslau silver wares manufactory of »Julius Lemor«, founded 1818, ceased 1945 (wordmark »LEMOR« in use from ca. 1920 on).
The picture with the other marks is shown by incidence upside down. Please look here: http://www.925-1000.com/Fpoland_marks_1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The big "mark" looks like to me, to be the screw area. If not, it must be cleaned up, and shown again.
Kind regards silverport
Hello
Welcome to the Forum.
The crucifix, in dimension maybe destinated for a family altar, is made after 1920 by the famous Breslau silver wares manufactory of »Julius Lemor«, founded 1818, ceased 1945 (wordmark »LEMOR« in use from ca. 1920 on).
The picture with the other marks is shown by incidence upside down. Please look here: http://www.925-1000.com/Fpoland_marks_1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The big "mark" looks like to me, to be the screw area. If not, it must be cleaned up, and shown again.
Kind regards silverport
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silverport
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- Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:18 pm
- Location: Portugal
Re: Cross Julius Lemor
Crucifix marked by »Julius Lemor« Breslau / Wroclaw, after 1920.
Hello »emm«
Would you please so kindly, to let the readers in »925-1000« know:
Was the to you given information a sufficient answer on yours question?
Was the advised link informative enough? : http://www.925-1000.com/Fpoland_marks_1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Have you “seen”, to turn marks upside down, for reason of help by the attempt of identification?
What is under covered in yours example of "big" marks area - a screw, a mark maybe too? Please clean up careful that area; if possible let's see in a photo.
I request you very kindly to answer.
By the way, that's a nice gesture between humans - for sure, also in Poland as well.
Kind regards silverport
Hello »emm«
Would you please so kindly, to let the readers in »925-1000« know:
Was the to you given information a sufficient answer on yours question?
Was the advised link informative enough? : http://www.925-1000.com/Fpoland_marks_1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Have you “seen”, to turn marks upside down, for reason of help by the attempt of identification?
What is under covered in yours example of "big" marks area - a screw, a mark maybe too? Please clean up careful that area; if possible let's see in a photo.
I request you very kindly to answer.
By the way, that's a nice gesture between humans - for sure, also in Poland as well.
Kind regards silverport
Re: Cross Julius Lemor
Good morning,
I'm sorry, but I couldn't reply on your post earlier. Of course, your informations about my crucifix and link with marks was very helpful and thank you so much for it.
I already know that this marks are upside down, I took this photo in that way because there are stamped like that (like on my photos:)). I only dont know what means this W, because in your link I read that W are on the silvers made in Warsaw (capital of Poland), but Silver Factory of Julius Lemor was in Wroclaw (Breslau). And unfortunatelly, I don't know what is the "big" mark, for me it doesn't look like a screw area, but I really don't know what exactly it is.
Kind Regards:)
I'm sorry, but I couldn't reply on your post earlier. Of course, your informations about my crucifix and link with marks was very helpful and thank you so much for it.
I already know that this marks are upside down, I took this photo in that way because there are stamped like that (like on my photos:)). I only dont know what means this W, because in your link I read that W are on the silvers made in Warsaw (capital of Poland), but Silver Factory of Julius Lemor was in Wroclaw (Breslau). And unfortunatelly, I don't know what is the "big" mark, for me it doesn't look like a screw area, but I really don't know what exactly it is.
Kind Regards:)
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silverport
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- Location: Portugal
Re: Cross Julius Lemor
1963-1986 marks on a crucifix, made by »Julius Lemor« Breslau / Wroclaw, marked in or after 1920.
Hello »emm«
The Polish marks on “your” crucifix are from 1963-1986: http://www.925-1000.com/Fpoland_marks_1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
That’s a time gap of at least 43 years — it was unmarked until 1963-1986, when some body took it to the »W« Warsaw Assay Office for assaying.
The Germans were 1945/1946 expulsed trough the Polish Government and trough the Polish population too.
For nearly all of these Millions of refugees and displaced persons was it only possible, to burden just their physical live only (I know from what I write). Neither crucifix they could take with them! A crucifix where in the night of leave, they have gone down on their knees, and have Christ requested to protect their live against the surrounding cruelties, and murder too.
Maybe Breslau/Wroclaw Assay Office has got in 1920 the letter »B« or maybe already »V«? That I don’t know — but Warsaw Assay Office has got in 1920 the letter »W«.
Don’t forget, that these marks are from 1963-1986! From 1963 on (?) was Wroclaw Assay Office letter »V«, and the letter of the Warsaw Assay Office remained since 1920 »W«.
Don’t forget also, that Assay Office marks are marks for indication that the item which bear this mark was in conformity of rules — so the item has got struck this mark on his surface.
Don’t forget, that an item witch bear a »W« Warsaw Assay Office mark is »assayed« in Warsaw — but not necessarily »made« in Warsaw capital!
Remember: The crucifix was unmarked until some day between 1963-1986, when some body took it to the »W« Warsaw Assay Office for assaying!
The “big mark” is maybe a mark? You’ve the crucifix — not I’m.
Here you could read some advises for clean up: http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic ... 34&t=19420" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
A temporary exhibition you should visit: http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic ... 42&t=20180" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Kind regards silverport
Hello »emm«
The Polish marks on “your” crucifix are from 1963-1986: http://www.925-1000.com/Fpoland_marks_1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
That’s a time gap of at least 43 years — it was unmarked until 1963-1986, when some body took it to the »W« Warsaw Assay Office for assaying.
The Germans were 1945/1946 expulsed trough the Polish Government and trough the Polish population too.
For nearly all of these Millions of refugees and displaced persons was it only possible, to burden just their physical live only (I know from what I write). Neither crucifix they could take with them! A crucifix where in the night of leave, they have gone down on their knees, and have Christ requested to protect their live against the surrounding cruelties, and murder too.
Maybe Breslau/Wroclaw Assay Office has got in 1920 the letter »B« or maybe already »V«? That I don’t know — but Warsaw Assay Office has got in 1920 the letter »W«.
Don’t forget, that these marks are from 1963-1986! From 1963 on (?) was Wroclaw Assay Office letter »V«, and the letter of the Warsaw Assay Office remained since 1920 »W«.
Don’t forget also, that Assay Office marks are marks for indication that the item which bear this mark was in conformity of rules — so the item has got struck this mark on his surface.
Don’t forget, that an item witch bear a »W« Warsaw Assay Office mark is »assayed« in Warsaw — but not necessarily »made« in Warsaw capital!
Remember: The crucifix was unmarked until some day between 1963-1986, when some body took it to the »W« Warsaw Assay Office for assaying!
The “big mark” is maybe a mark? You’ve the crucifix — not I’m.
Here you could read some advises for clean up: http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic ... 34&t=19420" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
A temporary exhibition you should visit: http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic ... 42&t=20180" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Kind regards silverport
Re: Cross Julius Lemor
Goodmorning silverport,
I'm impressed by all your knowledge, thanks again for all this informations.
But I didn't understand next things:
1. You said, that marks on this crucifix does not exist until 1963-1986. But on crucifix, as you can see, is LEMOR mark. Silver factory of Julius Lemor existed in years 1818-1945. So this cross was made by Julius Lemor or wasn't?
2. If it was made by Lemor's factroy, is it possible to mark it many years later? Or maybe "Lemor" inscription was made between 1920-1945 (you said in your first post that crucifix was made after 1920), and rest of this marks was made later, is it possible?
3. I did not quite understand your words about this Germans. I know that after World War II, Germans living in Poland were expulsed from here, but did you mean that they couldn't take all their stuff to Germany and leave it (this crucifix too) here?
Thanks a lot for all informations :)
Kind regards.
I'm impressed by all your knowledge, thanks again for all this informations.
But I didn't understand next things:
1. You said, that marks on this crucifix does not exist until 1963-1986. But on crucifix, as you can see, is LEMOR mark. Silver factory of Julius Lemor existed in years 1818-1945. So this cross was made by Julius Lemor or wasn't?
2. If it was made by Lemor's factroy, is it possible to mark it many years later? Or maybe "Lemor" inscription was made between 1920-1945 (you said in your first post that crucifix was made after 1920), and rest of this marks was made later, is it possible?
3. I did not quite understand your words about this Germans. I know that after World War II, Germans living in Poland were expulsed from here, but did you mean that they couldn't take all their stuff to Germany and leave it (this crucifix too) here?
Thanks a lot for all informations :)
Kind regards.
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silverport
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Re: Cross Julius Lemor
1963-1986 assay marks on a crucifix, made by »Julius Lemor« Breslau / Wroclaw, marked in, or after 1920.
Hello »emm«
It’s maybe difficult to understand this case of »maker’s mark« (1920-1939 * ), and not be assayed until some day 1963-1986.
Answer on »1«: The Polish assay marks, in the version 1963-1986 in use, haven’t existed before on the item; until some body took the crucifix to the Warsaw Assay Office for assaying.
To could be assayed, “normally” it’s necessary that there is struck already a maker’s mark. In this case, the crucifix was already marked by »Julius Lemor«. It was struck with a normal »maker’s mark« for hollowware of that time (»LEMOR«), when it was marked in their factory. That could have happen from around 1920 until August 1939 *.
The assaying in Warsaw was successful; so the crucifix has got the Warsaw assay marks in value (1963-1986) struck on his surface.
Answer on »2«: Nothing is impossible - all is possible! Marking directly after be produced, until be marked after taken out of internal stock, for fulfil a sales order (some clients, e.g. wholesaler claimed that items be struck with their mark only - there fore must be a few unmarked items hold in stock).
This kind of crucifix was a version, which was already a decennium in Lemor’s production — one example, made from 1908 ongoing is in Wroclaw: »z kolekcji Dr. Rainer Lemor, Heikendorf — depozyt Muzeum Miejskie we Wroclawiu«
Between that crucifix of Dr. Rainer Lemor and this one is only a difference in the form of pedestal:
The version Dr. Lemor own, the pedestal is made by a lathe processing = radial symmetric steps with cones (total height: 33 cm; total weight: 420 g). It is marked with the initials-maker’s-mark »JAL« (letters in a tall Grotesque type, framed by a horizontal super oval), in use from about 1906 on, and the here shown word mark »LEMOR«.
This version has a pedestal in a more classic oriented style. That was an attempt of that time around 1920, to over win the »Jugendstil« (»Art Nouveau«, »nowoczesnym stylu«).
Now, when I’ve got knowledge of the marks on the crucifix, deposited in Wroclaw, my guess is that the “big” mark on this crucifix could be the above described »JAL« initials-maker’s-mark.
The time frame of the crucifix in the Wroclaw deposit is described as: »… ab 1908« (»… from 1908 on«; »… od 1908«). That means, first published in catalogues, or sales offers, or publications for professionals, like e.g. jeweller. But not all items which were 1908 offered, are all made once for ever! Maybe first series were ten item, next series were constant thirty items?
Maybe both crucifixes were made in the same time frame of around 1920, with equal cross and corpus Christy — but have got differing pedestal; in conform style of additional offered candlesticks?
In general: »Julius Lemor« is described as existing active 1818-1945.
* But the traditional production has ended in August 1939!
Answer on »3«: Yes, from these Germans only very few, who had leaved very early could take all (?) their stuff to Germany. Million others had to leave their stuff — yes this crucifix too!
Here I will not open a political or historical discussion — in America, Germany and Poland are already discussion groups.
Let me state this: In the last decennia is grown on both sides of the border an understanding of each other!
For silver collectors: http://www.agraart.pl/silver/index.php? ... 69&cnt=208" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
But why now this? Brak wyników!
Another human example: http://www.upstreamvistula.org/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Here an excerpt on »Lemor« (ISBN 83-917909-6-7, page 75 — sorry, I haven’t Polish letters): »Dnia 13.1.1945 r. Rosjanie przelamali front wschodni i w ciagu 2 tygodni znalezli sie w odleglosci 30 km od Wroclawia. … W styczniu 1945 r. zostawilismy firme zupelnie nie uszkodzona. Na dziedzincu lezaly jeszcze duze stosy polfabrykatow. ... Obok od lat zamknietego magazynu i zapasow srebrnego surowca pozostawiono takze 6.300 srebrenych monet z lat 1500-1871, gromadzonych podczas wojny, jednak z powodu ich numizmatyczenej wartosci nigdy nieprzetopionych. Ponadto pozostal jeszcze znaczny magazyn wyrobow krysztalowych z matowo szlifowanymi brzegami przeznaczonymi do oprawienia w srebro«.
Brief translation: »On 13 january 1945 the Russian Army has cut the front-line, 14 days later they were 30 km in front of Wroclaw. … By the leave [becoming refugees: end January 1945] the factory was not destroyed, and full in function. On factory’s court remained a huge mount of delivered material. … The since years in security closed warehouse, filled up with already finished flatware and hollowware, raw silver deposit, and 6,300 coins from 1500-1871 was leaved untouched too. Also a huge amount of lead-crystal wares; already prepared for silver mountings«.
You "have" the crucifix; but you're not the "owner" - also you've buy it from some body who has buy it from some body who has buy it from some body ...
What do you think now, from where all the German stuff comes from; which leaves now Polish homes, e.g. for reason of "inherence", and fills up now the collectors market in Poland, and from Poland the global internet?
Sources you should buy (in German, Polish, and an English abstract):
Rainer Lemor: Julius Lemor, Breslau — Wroclaw, Silberwarenfabrik — Fabryka wyrobow srebrnych, 1818-1945. Muzeum Miejskie Wroclawia. Wroclaw 2003. ISBN 83-917909-6-7
http://www.mmw.pl/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
There are more books on silver too: http://www.mmw.pl/muzeum/publikacje.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
e-mail: sekretariat@mmw.pl
(In German, and Polish): Rainer Lemor, Martin Kügler: Silber aus Schlesien — Srebro ze Slaska, 1871-1945. Görlitz 2010. ISBN 978-3-9813510-2-6
http://www.schlesisches-museum.de" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
e-mail: kontakt@schlesisches-museum.de
It isn’t easy, and some times shocking as well!
Kind regards silverport
Hello »emm«
It’s maybe difficult to understand this case of »maker’s mark« (1920-1939 * ), and not be assayed until some day 1963-1986.
Answer on »1«: The Polish assay marks, in the version 1963-1986 in use, haven’t existed before on the item; until some body took the crucifix to the Warsaw Assay Office for assaying.
To could be assayed, “normally” it’s necessary that there is struck already a maker’s mark. In this case, the crucifix was already marked by »Julius Lemor«. It was struck with a normal »maker’s mark« for hollowware of that time (»LEMOR«), when it was marked in their factory. That could have happen from around 1920 until August 1939 *.
The assaying in Warsaw was successful; so the crucifix has got the Warsaw assay marks in value (1963-1986) struck on his surface.
Answer on »2«: Nothing is impossible - all is possible! Marking directly after be produced, until be marked after taken out of internal stock, for fulfil a sales order (some clients, e.g. wholesaler claimed that items be struck with their mark only - there fore must be a few unmarked items hold in stock).
This kind of crucifix was a version, which was already a decennium in Lemor’s production — one example, made from 1908 ongoing is in Wroclaw: »z kolekcji Dr. Rainer Lemor, Heikendorf — depozyt Muzeum Miejskie we Wroclawiu«
Between that crucifix of Dr. Rainer Lemor and this one is only a difference in the form of pedestal:
The version Dr. Lemor own, the pedestal is made by a lathe processing = radial symmetric steps with cones (total height: 33 cm; total weight: 420 g). It is marked with the initials-maker’s-mark »JAL« (letters in a tall Grotesque type, framed by a horizontal super oval), in use from about 1906 on, and the here shown word mark »LEMOR«.
This version has a pedestal in a more classic oriented style. That was an attempt of that time around 1920, to over win the »Jugendstil« (»Art Nouveau«, »nowoczesnym stylu«).
Now, when I’ve got knowledge of the marks on the crucifix, deposited in Wroclaw, my guess is that the “big” mark on this crucifix could be the above described »JAL« initials-maker’s-mark.
The time frame of the crucifix in the Wroclaw deposit is described as: »… ab 1908« (»… from 1908 on«; »… od 1908«). That means, first published in catalogues, or sales offers, or publications for professionals, like e.g. jeweller. But not all items which were 1908 offered, are all made once for ever! Maybe first series were ten item, next series were constant thirty items?
Maybe both crucifixes were made in the same time frame of around 1920, with equal cross and corpus Christy — but have got differing pedestal; in conform style of additional offered candlesticks?
In general: »Julius Lemor« is described as existing active 1818-1945.
* But the traditional production has ended in August 1939!
Answer on »3«: Yes, from these Germans only very few, who had leaved very early could take all (?) their stuff to Germany. Million others had to leave their stuff — yes this crucifix too!
Here I will not open a political or historical discussion — in America, Germany and Poland are already discussion groups.
Let me state this: In the last decennia is grown on both sides of the border an understanding of each other!
For silver collectors: http://www.agraart.pl/silver/index.php? ... 69&cnt=208" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
But why now this? Brak wyników!
Another human example: http://www.upstreamvistula.org/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Here an excerpt on »Lemor« (ISBN 83-917909-6-7, page 75 — sorry, I haven’t Polish letters): »Dnia 13.1.1945 r. Rosjanie przelamali front wschodni i w ciagu 2 tygodni znalezli sie w odleglosci 30 km od Wroclawia. … W styczniu 1945 r. zostawilismy firme zupelnie nie uszkodzona. Na dziedzincu lezaly jeszcze duze stosy polfabrykatow. ... Obok od lat zamknietego magazynu i zapasow srebrnego surowca pozostawiono takze 6.300 srebrenych monet z lat 1500-1871, gromadzonych podczas wojny, jednak z powodu ich numizmatyczenej wartosci nigdy nieprzetopionych. Ponadto pozostal jeszcze znaczny magazyn wyrobow krysztalowych z matowo szlifowanymi brzegami przeznaczonymi do oprawienia w srebro«.
Brief translation: »On 13 january 1945 the Russian Army has cut the front-line, 14 days later they were 30 km in front of Wroclaw. … By the leave [becoming refugees: end January 1945] the factory was not destroyed, and full in function. On factory’s court remained a huge mount of delivered material. … The since years in security closed warehouse, filled up with already finished flatware and hollowware, raw silver deposit, and 6,300 coins from 1500-1871 was leaved untouched too. Also a huge amount of lead-crystal wares; already prepared for silver mountings«.
You "have" the crucifix; but you're not the "owner" - also you've buy it from some body who has buy it from some body who has buy it from some body ...
What do you think now, from where all the German stuff comes from; which leaves now Polish homes, e.g. for reason of "inherence", and fills up now the collectors market in Poland, and from Poland the global internet?
Sources you should buy (in German, Polish, and an English abstract):
Rainer Lemor: Julius Lemor, Breslau — Wroclaw, Silberwarenfabrik — Fabryka wyrobow srebrnych, 1818-1945. Muzeum Miejskie Wroclawia. Wroclaw 2003. ISBN 83-917909-6-7
http://www.mmw.pl/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
There are more books on silver too: http://www.mmw.pl/muzeum/publikacje.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
e-mail: sekretariat@mmw.pl
(In German, and Polish): Rainer Lemor, Martin Kügler: Silber aus Schlesien — Srebro ze Slaska, 1871-1945. Görlitz 2010. ISBN 978-3-9813510-2-6
http://www.schlesisches-museum.de" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
e-mail: kontakt@schlesisches-museum.de
It isn’t easy, and some times shocking as well!
Kind regards silverport
-
silverport
- contributor
- Posts: 870
- Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:18 pm
- Location: Portugal
Re: Cross Julius Lemor
Crucifix, which owns Dr. Lemor, is shown in Görlitz exhibition.
Hello »emm«
The crucifix which Dr. Lemor owns, is actually shown, until 3 October 2010, in the exhibition »Srebro ze Slaska« (»Silver from Silesia«), held in the »Schlesisches Museum zu Görlitz«.
In the Catalogue of this exhibition it’s shown on page 64, catalogue-number 66 (with a brief description). There are also in form of brief biographies described companies and workshops (p. 93-106), and their maker’s marks (p. 107-114 = about 220 marks).
In the biographic publication on »Julius Lemor, Breslau / Wroclaw« the crucifix which Dr. Lemor owns, is shown on p. 99, nr. 53 and in brief described on p. 140 (top right).
I saw on a map that the university town »Zielona Gora«, where you live, isn’t so far away from Görlitz or Wroclaw — I hope you could take the chance for a personal »vis-à -vis« with the history.
Kind regards silverport
Hello »emm«
The crucifix which Dr. Lemor owns, is actually shown, until 3 October 2010, in the exhibition »Srebro ze Slaska« (»Silver from Silesia«), held in the »Schlesisches Museum zu Görlitz«.
In the Catalogue of this exhibition it’s shown on page 64, catalogue-number 66 (with a brief description). There are also in form of brief biographies described companies and workshops (p. 93-106), and their maker’s marks (p. 107-114 = about 220 marks).
In the biographic publication on »Julius Lemor, Breslau / Wroclaw« the crucifix which Dr. Lemor owns, is shown on p. 99, nr. 53 and in brief described on p. 140 (top right).
I saw on a map that the university town »Zielona Gora«, where you live, isn’t so far away from Görlitz or Wroclaw — I hope you could take the chance for a personal »vis-à -vis« with the history.
Kind regards silverport
-
silverport
- contributor
- Posts: 870
- Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:18 pm
- Location: Portugal
Re: Cross Julius Lemor
I’m astonished on our both historical ignorance — (1741) 1918-1945 = Breslau
Hello »emm«
Sorry, I’m the same as you — we’ve by stupidity ignored historical facts: In the time of »Lemor’s« existence (1818-1945), never it was necessary to go with any item to a, then in Breslau not existing, Polish Assay Office!
1888 came also in Breslau in force the German Empire’s law: The minimum fineness, for items made from Silver, had to be 800-1,000. These had to be marked with the maker’s mark, the »Crescent« (symbol for “silver”) and »Imperial Crown« (symbol for “originated from German area”), and the actual fineness of the item, in Arabic ciphers.
The producer was the only responsible for this kind of marking.
The Breslau Gold- and Silversmith's Guild was ceased and closed in 1893 — then after a general assay control, as I know, hasn’t there existed any more.
Some time after 1945/1946 was later in »Wroclaw« established a first Polish Assay Office.
So, the crucifix was marked correct; in conformity with the law, in force during his production and marking!
That in the Polish Assay marks, struck some day in 1963-1986, isn’t a »W« standing for »Wroclaw«, but for »Warsaw«, is only result of Polish history — and couldn’t be ignored by local patriotism. From at least 1741-1945/1946 there wasn’t a »Wroclaw«, but »Breslau«.
The »V« in the modern Polish Assay Office indication letter of »Wroclaw« is maybe sounded correct by the name of the historic Bohemian duke »Vratislaw I« and the Latin name of »Wroclaw«: »Vratislavia«.
So my doubts on Wroclaw Polish Assay indication letter between the two WW is totally invalidate!
Maybe yours personally doubts and questions on this theme could be understood, only as the result of the past Polish ignorance in history education?
Now let’s change from this very difficult part of the topic, to the other, even difficult one: »Ownership«
The interims Polish Government of 1945/1946 has published on:
6 May 1945 a law,
8 March 1946 a decree, and on
24 March 1946 regulations
on abandoned German goods and property.
You must study these by your self, because they are all written in a juridical Polish — Polish I’ve forgotten since 6 January 1946, day of »Epiphany«, when we were finally expulsed. Then only we could take with us our physical live; no documents, no property — all the same way as Millions of other Germans too. That is another, very important story too — but please not here!
Remember: Warehouse and shops of »Lemor« were leaved by them in January 1945, and then full of items!
Kind regards silverport
Hello »emm«
Sorry, I’m the same as you — we’ve by stupidity ignored historical facts: In the time of »Lemor’s« existence (1818-1945), never it was necessary to go with any item to a, then in Breslau not existing, Polish Assay Office!
1888 came also in Breslau in force the German Empire’s law: The minimum fineness, for items made from Silver, had to be 800-1,000. These had to be marked with the maker’s mark, the »Crescent« (symbol for “silver”) and »Imperial Crown« (symbol for “originated from German area”), and the actual fineness of the item, in Arabic ciphers.
The producer was the only responsible for this kind of marking.
The Breslau Gold- and Silversmith's Guild was ceased and closed in 1893 — then after a general assay control, as I know, hasn’t there existed any more.
Some time after 1945/1946 was later in »Wroclaw« established a first Polish Assay Office.
So, the crucifix was marked correct; in conformity with the law, in force during his production and marking!
That in the Polish Assay marks, struck some day in 1963-1986, isn’t a »W« standing for »Wroclaw«, but for »Warsaw«, is only result of Polish history — and couldn’t be ignored by local patriotism. From at least 1741-1945/1946 there wasn’t a »Wroclaw«, but »Breslau«.
The »V« in the modern Polish Assay Office indication letter of »Wroclaw« is maybe sounded correct by the name of the historic Bohemian duke »Vratislaw I« and the Latin name of »Wroclaw«: »Vratislavia«.
So my doubts on Wroclaw Polish Assay indication letter between the two WW is totally invalidate!
Maybe yours personally doubts and questions on this theme could be understood, only as the result of the past Polish ignorance in history education?
Now let’s change from this very difficult part of the topic, to the other, even difficult one: »Ownership«
The interims Polish Government of 1945/1946 has published on:
6 May 1945 a law,
8 March 1946 a decree, and on
24 March 1946 regulations
on abandoned German goods and property.
You must study these by your self, because they are all written in a juridical Polish — Polish I’ve forgotten since 6 January 1946, day of »Epiphany«, when we were finally expulsed. Then only we could take with us our physical live; no documents, no property — all the same way as Millions of other Germans too. That is another, very important story too — but please not here!
Remember: Warehouse and shops of »Lemor« were leaved by them in January 1945, and then full of items!
Kind regards silverport
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jeanleryenierga
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:32 am
Re: Cross Julius Lemor
This crucifix was actually gorgeous to put in the altar because of its preventive design. It was made out of silver case. I was expected to have also the same crucifix that was made by Julius Lemor.silverport wrote:Crucifix made by »Julius Lemor« Breslau / Wroclaw, after 1920.
Hello
Welcome to the Forum.
The crucifix, in dimension maybe destinated for a family altar, is made after 1920 by the famous Breslau silver wares manufactory of »Julius Lemor«, founded 1818, ceased 1945 (wordmark »LEMOR« in use from ca. 1920 on).
The picture with the other marks is shown by incidence upside down. Please look here: http://www.925-1000.com/Fpoland_marks_1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The big "mark" looks like to me, to be the screw area. If not, it must be cleaned up, and shown again.
Kind regards silverport